Is this normal?

[sjr1118]

This is pretty strange....99 corvette with 35,000 miles.
Drove it to my brother's house in the morning and parked it in his driveway for the day. Around 10 pm, got in it to drive home and I noticed I was low on gas.
The readout said "reserve fuel"
Then it flashed "service ABS"
Then it flashed "service traction control"

The messages kept flashing till I got to the first gas station, turned off the engine, filled the tank, started her up and all was well...no more flashing messages.

I guess I wont let the gas tank get that low ever again.

Anyone else ever experience this?

[C5pilot]

Not sure how the ABS and TC figure into this but the gas gage dropping to empty is a known issue on C5's. How much gas did it actually take?

[sjr1118]

I would say it took about 11 gallons

[Bill Burkholder]

It is not normal.... codes???????? Run the codes and post them....

The IPC display, the 20-character, vacuum florescent screen above the steering column that says "Corvette by Chevrolet" every time you turn on the key is a powerful device.

DIY Service Techs are going to be most interested in the LPG�s ability to show diagnostic trouble codes (DTC) for all the modules that transmit them..

The "diagnostic display" mode is entered with the following Procedure: Page 8-500

1. Turn on the ignition but don't start the engine.
2. Press the "reset" button to turn off any warning messages
3. Press and hold "options" and
4. While holding "options", press "fuel" four times within a 10-Second period.

Initially, the on-board diagnostics go into the "automatic" mode, which shows each module's DTCs in a pre-set sequence: (Page No. are for the GM Service Manual)

* 10 PCNI Powertrain Control Module page 6-357 - 6-361
* 28 TCS Traction Control system ABS on page 5-86
* ?? RTD Real Time damping page 3-136
* 40 BCM Body Control Module page 8-405 LTD Page 8-727
* 60 [PC instrument Pane! Cluster page 8-508
* 80 radio page 8-213
* 99 FIVAC Heater Vent-Air Conditioning page 1-118
* A0 LDCM Left Door Control module page 8-904 to 8-951
* Al RDCM Right Door Control Module page 8-904 to 8-951
* AC SCM Seat Control module page 8-1064-8-1082
* B0 RFA Remote Function Actuation page 8-676

For each module, all DTCs will be displayed. If none are present in a module, you will see "no more codes" on the ICP display. There are two kinds of DTCs, "Current" and "History," designated with a letter suffix, "C" or "H". A current code indicates that the malfunction is present in the system whose module is displaying data. A history code indicates a problem existed in that module sometime in the last 40 or 50 ignition cycles. When not accompanied by a current code of the same number, it is possible it's evidence of a previous problem. Now solved, that was not removed by clearing codes. More likely is that a history code indicates an intermittent malfunction.

"Intermittent" are the most challenging DTCs. An intermittent may have happened only once, may have happened more than once but is inconsistent in its appearance or may be happening on a regular basis but not at the time the IPC is displaying codes. History codes can also be caused by a current malfunction in a system that is not Operating at the time DTCs are displayed. An example is the rear window defogger, which doesn't operate until the BCM detects engine rpm. For history codes set by a system that does not operate with the key on and engine off, a special diagnostic tool called a "scan tester is necessary to properly diagnose the malfunction.

Once the IPC has displayed all 11 modules, the system goes into the manual mode, which allows selection of each module, using combinations of DIC buttons. The manual mode can also be entered at any time during the automatic sequence by pressing any button except "E/M". Once the IPC displays "manual diagnostics", you may select a particular module by pressing the options button to go forward or the "trip" button to go back. Once a system is selected and a DTC is displayed, if more than one are present; press "gages" To move forward or "fuel" to go back. To exit the diagnostic mode at any time, press E/M". If you want to erase or "clear" codes, press "reset". Clearing a code does not repair a problem. You are simply erasing the evidence of it in the module's memory.

[C5pilot]

It's not a cheap repair, I think you have to have 2 sending units replaced. You'll have to check with Bryner to see if it can still be repaired free of charge under a TSB since your warranty is expired.

Lastly, certain brands of gas can have an effect on the sending units. If you can remember where you purchased the gas just before the problem, try switching to another brand. Personally, I try to use Shell whenever I can find it. Sunoco "seems" to be a brand that's frequently associated with this problem. In the meantime, treat your tank with some Techron.

[Bill Burkholder]

Joe with the other warning lights I would think that there may be an issue with the drivers door. If he has a list of codes in the LDCM & RDCM sections it could be a minor fix. He needs to run the codes and post them. He could have by opening and closing the drivers door "fixed" the problem for now.

[C5pilot]

It sounds like more than one problem (or a software glitch). Hopefully he'll get back to you with any codes. But the gas gage dropping to empty is a well known issue. It's possible they may have software updates for the gas gage problem instead of removing both sending units like they did in my 98 (twice). The extended warranty on the 98 was money VERY well spent in my case.

[sjr1118]

As usual, you guys are a great source of knowledge. I will get the codes out and post them here.

Just to add to the information, I was low on gas, the gas gauge did not just drop to empty on its own, I was slightly above the empty line before this problem occurred. ( generally, I never run any of my cars with less than 1/4 tank, but I was on my way to a funeral and had no time to stop for gas in the morning)

Also.....since the closest station to my house is a Sunoco, I have been buying mostly Sunoco gas, one grade lower than ultra. Should I try to avoid Sunoco?

I can get Shell or Gulf easily. I try to avoid the Russian and the Venezuelan stations.

[hcvone]

Originally Posted by sjr1118

As usual, you guys are a great source of knowledge. I will get the codes out and post them here.

Just to add to the information, I was low on gas, the gas gauge did not just drop to empty on its own, I was slightly above the empty line before this problem occurred. ( generally, I never run any of my cars with less than 1/4 tank, but I was on my way to a funeral and had no time to stop for gas in the morning)

Also.....since the closest station to my house is a Sunoco, I have been buying mostly Sunoco gas, one grade lower than ultra. Should I try to avoid Sunoco?

I can get Shell or Gulf easily. I try to avoid the Russian and the Venezuelan stations.

Bryner must not own Sunoco stock that is why they tell you not to use it, I used nothing but Sunoco in all four C5's and never had an issue, I always ran 93 or 94 octane. Because of your fuel level you may have got the codes because of transfer issues from one tank to the other.

[Frank Gonzalez]

Count me in as a highly satisfied Sunoco user (almost exclusively) on 3 different C5 and C6 cars.

NEVER A PROBLEM.

For whatever it's worth, Bryner doesn't have the resources to determine which gas is good or bad. They may elect to draw conclusions from the cars they see, but where I studied statistics their results are clasified as hearsay.

Frank Gonzalez

[Mike Campbell]

The Sunoco gas was a problem with pre-2000 Corvettes. I had the same thing happen to my C5. The fuel sending units were re-engineered for later cars. However, as far as fuel detergent & keeping your engine running better, GM recommends several other "Top Tier" gasolines. Doesn't mean you shouldn't use Sunoco. Just means they recommend several other brands.

[Mike Campbell]

By the way, my comments are related directly to my own experience whereas the second tank of Sunoco in my 99 ate the SOB's. Thankfully, my car was still under warranty and Bryner's is excellent.

[hcvone]

Why would I trust what a dealership would tell me without any science to backup their claims when I know many Corvette owners that use nothing but Sunoco fuel, and two Sunoco stations I know of the owners have had Corvette's for years, and I can tell you they do not fill their cars at other stations. I am glad you follow what the dealership says, but many think for themselves, and make sure you drink the kool-aid Tuesday.

[hcvone]

The problem is all top tier fuels are a voluntary program, many companies chose not to spend the money. Here is a letter from Exxon:

ExxonMobil has been providing detergent additized gasolines since the 1950s and we are proud of our historical leadership in this area. In fact, back in 1985, ExxonMobil pioneered gasolines that cleaned up fuel injector deposits. All of our current gasolines are formulated to meet stringent performance standards and exceed all industry and government specifications for detergency. All Exxon and Mobil gasolines pass the performance criteria of the TOP TIER program.

Thank you for contacting ExxonMobil.

Jacqueline Levesque
Exxon Mobil Corporation"


I just sent off e-mails to Sunoco and directed them to Bryner Chevy in Jenkintown to straighten out the war between Bryner and Sunoco, will post any info received.

[Bill Burkholder]

Now to get back on track.....If you post the codes I'll look them up and tell you what they are. Bill

[C5pilot]

Originally Posted by sjr1118

Just to add to the information, I was low on gas, the gas gauge did not just drop to empty on its own, I was slightly above the empty line before this problem occurred. ( generally, I never run any of my cars with less than 1/4 tank, but I was on my way to a funeral and had no time to stop for gas in the morning)

Glad to hear it didn't drop to empty, however, you have to wonder why it read near empty if it only took 11 gallons. You couldn't possibly have been on reserve fuel unless you didn't actually fill the tank 100%. You'd be closer to 1/3 tank if 11 gallons filled it. Get Bill those codes.

[sjr1118]

Uh Oh...lots of codes....

28-TCS ...C-1281

BO-RFA ...U1016 U1096 U1064 C2100

AO-LDCM ...B2284 B2282 U1064 U1016 U1096 U1255

A1-RDCM ...B2283 B2285 B2273 U1255 U1064

U1016 U1096


I hope I took them off correctly, looks like a lot of codes

[Bill Burkholder]

Originally Posted by sjr1118

Uh Oh...lots of codes....

28-TCS ...C-1281
C1281 Steering Sensor Uncorrelated Malfunction

BO-RFA ...U1016 U1096 U1064 C2100
U1016 Loss of Communication with PCM
U1064 Loss of Communication with BCM
U1096 Loss of Communication with IPC
C2100 Left Front TPM Sensor Malfunction

AO-LDCM ...B2284 B2282 U1064 U1016 U1096 U1255
U1016 Loss of Communication with PCM
B2284 Battery #2 Fault
U1064 Loss of Communications with BCM
U1096 Loss of Communications with IPC
U1255 Serial Data Line Malfunction
B2282 Battery #1 Fault

A1-RDCM ...B2283 B2285 B2273 U1255 U1064

U1016 U1096
U1016 Loss of Communication with PCM
B2283 Battery #1 Fault
B2285 Battery #2 Fault
U1064 Loss of Communications with BCM
U1096 Loss of Communications with IPC
U1255 Serial Data Line Malfunction
B2273 Right Mirror Motor Fault


I hope I took them off correctly, looks like a lot of codes

I think your problem may be the drivers door wiring or door module. By any chance did you hit a bump pulling into the gas station or stall the engine while engaging the clutch???
First start by making sure the battery cables are not loose. Next check the wiring that is in the accordion tube that goes from the door to the door pillar (drivers side). Pull the tube out and then fish the wire bundles from inside the door pillar. Make sure the plugs are tight and that all the contacts are clean. Unplug them check them and then put them back in the door pillar. Turn the key on and make sure both doors lock/ unlock and both windows go up/ down, both mirrors work. If everything seems ok then put the accordion tube back. Now go back and clear all the codes in the DIC. As I mentioned in my first post, i knew that you would have LDCM, RDCM codes, make sure that your battery is fully charged using an battery maintainer, these cars don't like voltage changes....

[Rick and Arleen Ball]

Originally Posted by Bill Burkholder

I think your problem may be the drivers door wiring or door module. By any chance did you hit a bump pulling into the gas station or stall the engine while engaging the clutch???
First start by making sure the battery cables are not loose. Next check the wiring that is in the accordion tube that goes from the door to the door pillar (drivers side). Pull the tube out and then fish the wire bundles from inside the door pillar. Make sure the plugs are tight and that all the contacts are clean. Unplug them check them and then put them back in the door pillar. Turn the key on and make sure both doors lock/ unlock and both windows go up/ down, both mirrors work. If everything seems ok then put the accordion tube back. Now go back and clear all the codes in the DIC. As I mentioned in my first post, i knew that you would have LDCM, RDCM codes, make sure that your battery is fully charged using an battery maintainer, these cars don't like voltage changes....

Also make sure you treated your windshield with RainX. Buckle and unbuckle your seatbelt twice, brush your hair, not comb it as static electricity will come into play.
Last but not least. Make sure you have used the proper tire dressing. LOL!
This is why I LOVE MID YEARS!!!!!
But SERIOUSLY! Listen to Bill or check with Bryners. I'm sure either will get your problem solved. Bill has helped me numerous times.
Rick

[sjr1118]

I would like to thank everyone for your help. I think it may have been one of those "computer gliches".

Been driving all weekend with no further issues.

I will try to run Shell in it from now on though.

Steve